Nalle Hukkataival fresh off the plane after the journey from Australia to South Africa:
I just made the first repeat of Paul Robinson’s V15, A Simple Knowing1, at Topside. I managed to climb it quickly in half an hour. It’s a nice problem, but once again nowhere near the difficulty that I consider V15. On a related note, here’s a photo of Livin’ Large…
Hukkataival registered A Simple Knowing at V13 on his 27Crags ticklist, and he registered repeats of two other Robinson FAs at Topside that he suggested downgrades for as well.
Update: Well, Dave Graham has also repeated A Simple Knowing according to 27Crags, and apparently he and Hukkataival both found and used some better beta which explains the downgrade a bit better. Graham had this to say on his 8a scorecard:
Awesome prow climbing with big tension moves, ending in a legendary ninja swoop! Props to Paul for FA, its a great problem! Took me two sessions to put er down, grace of the left heal-toe cam we worked out with the posse. It definitely felt like 8b+, even with the new method.
Props to Nalle for being so Brave and Humble.
On a more serious note – dude is strooooong. Keep on crushing.
loading...
“once again nowhere near the difficulty that I consider V15.”
I’m wondering what other V15’s Nalle is alluding to with this statement.
loading...
As narc said, check his 27Crags ticklist (http://27crags.com/climbers/hukknal/ascents/boulder/descending/by/grade)
loading...
Indeed, but none of those problems he downgraded were originally credited as V15 at least according to his list.
loading...
Thanks for the link….good to see top climbers putting their ticks online (onto a much better site than 8fail.fu).
:p
loading...
I agree Nalle is strong, but his ego is a bit much at times. He was referring to Livin’ Large in that V15 statement.
loading...
For someone who is a strong as Nalle, he is so very uninspiring, and seems far from humble.
Livin’ Large looks like an uninspiring problem too – if I could climb V15, i’d be putting my efforts into some of the decent looking lines in SA.
loading...
wthell!!!!!!, livin large looks trully sublime
loading...
Having seen Livin’ Large and many other 8Cs from my own eyes, Livin’ Large is the most inspiring line among them in my opinion. Very impressive boulder and scary high when you are standing underneath. It’s also the one that looks the most impossible to climb.
loading...
I think Livin Large looks amazing and I’m with Haroun on this one, one of the most inspiring lines there is.
Don’t know if there is that much climbing in Saudi Arabia Ben but ZA has some pretty decent stuff 😀
loading...
ZA’s the ‘offical’ abbreviation, but we all use SA. ZA’s only for domain names and the stickers you have to put on your car when you drive across the border into other African states. Just sayin’… :p
loading...
ZA is also heavily used by foreigners to make it seem like they are more local than they are 🙂
loading...
We also just try to be sarcatic in comments sometimes 🙂
loading...
Paul says Nalle’s is too high maintenance, and not all that cute. Nalle responds by saying Paul’s is too easy. Welcome to junior high.
loading...
it might also be worthwhile to state that nalle was able to find much easier beta on a simple knowing than paul used for the first ascent which he completely failed to state, on purpose i would presume.
loading...
Maybe failing to report finding better beta is not very nice.
But on the other hand finding the easiest solution to a problem is an important part of bouldering also. In the end any problem can be climbed in a very hard way with shitty beta. You’re just not a very good boulderer if you can’t find the best solution to the boulder problem.
loading...
Yeah, Paul Robinson is clearly not a very good boulderer . . .
loading...
Hilarious that 6 persons (so far) think a guy who has sent multiple confirmed v15s and 8C’s is “not a very good boulderer” Carry on.
loading...
Where does it say Nalle used the new heel-toe cam?
loading...
Carlo Traversi mentioned it over on 8a. Along with some scathing words about misrepresentation and being unprofessional. Let the drama being in earnest now….
loading...
link?
loading...
try here
loading...
Carlo T went all crazy , ‘egotistical asshole’ jeeez!!!!
loading...
Apparently the drama of the Boulder bubble has moved south for the summer
loading...
I really hope these dudes are all climbing with each other and having a good time out there. It would really suck if they just formed little cliques and took shots at each other on the internet.
loading...
come on, professional climbers are some of the most generous, charitable athletes out there. i could list countless examples of publicized donations and goodwill to those less fortunate with no trust fund… hmmm. wait. no. damn.
loading...
Paul doesn’t seem too happy judging by his 27crags either:
http://27crags.com/crags/st-james-park/routes/a-simple-knowing
loading...
totally justified, it must be humiliating for someone to come along and look at what you felt to be an amazing piece of bouldering (espescially as a pro) then say its not that good and basically only worth 30 mins of your time. If you dedicate your whole life to bouldering, there are obviously feelings involved
loading...
Bad weather everywhere aye…? 😉
I do not understand what’s the big deal with this. It’s just a piece of rock that’s also a hard climb. Downgrading takes place all the time. People find better beta or simply get stronger. Top climbers also clearly need to find a concensus on what is extremely hard – now there seems to be a clear lack of concensus.
First ascentionists might not always discover the best beta, be it due to time restrictions etc Though, to climb a boulder categorized extremely hard in 30 mins while jet-lagged, seems like a joke…Most people struggle with easier ones for months to even years before succeeding.
Now, back to drinking coffee and watching the rain…:)
loading...
It’s pretty obvious that the problem is not that Nalle downgraded it, but the way in which he did so.
loading...
Dave probrably found the beta that Nalle used anyway. I think Nalle is trying to lure strong climbers to try and repeat his problem which he feels is probrably the hardest in the world. The fact that they are not trying it more is getting at him.
loading...
If that were his goal, he probably could have found a more tactful way of going about it
loading...
I mean, it’s obviously a pot shot at Paul for whatever disparaging comments (some of which were clarified) he made about Livin’ Large back in the day.
With the photo splash, I am pretty sure that Nalle wasn’t even trying to hide his sentiment.
In the grand scheme of things, I don’t mind the comment as much – he had climbed Paul’s v15 (new beta or not) super quickly – that puts him in a better position to comment on the (quality/difficulty of the) boulder than say if he had only hiked up to it and not even climbed it.
loading...
I feel like this may have stemmed from a previous post by paul:
http://p-d-robinson.tumblr.com/post/811384618/derailed-check
loading...
Which he then cleared up here:
http://p-d-robinson.tumblr.com/post/879801422/a-few-things-to-clear-up
Basically, why put a portion of his limited time and money into something that doesn’t really inspire him, when there’s other hard, inspirational stuff that will take less time and coin. I think Paul is just denying the push toward a competitive outlook on bouldering – you don’t have to go around and repeat every hard line that goes up to prove you are the best. It’s enough for him to boulder at his absolute limit on his own terms, and be the best boulderer he can be, not the best boulderer overall by having to go one-for-one on all the hard stuff others do.
Paul, I genuinely think (or atleast hope) that Nalle wasn’t trying to humiliate or slander you with his downgrade. Finding a line, cleaning it, and proving to the world that it goes takes a much larger investment than repeats. I feel like knowing that it goes (period) lifts a huge weight off ones shoulders when working it. Please don’t get suckered into being competitive on someone elses terms, just climb for yourself (well, and whoever is paying the bills).
It should be noted that Ondra did go try Livin Large, thought it was cool, but just couldn’t put it together in time. That said, Ondra’s M.O. has very much been “Go find the allegedly hardest stuff anyone else has done, and repeat it”
loading...
In the link Ondra talks abut livin large, if anyones interested.
http://www.blackdiamondequipment.com/en-us/journal/climb//bd-athlete-adam-ondra-wraps-up-his-trip-to-rocklands-south-africa
loading...
I really hope that this little soap opera doesn’t ruin any motivation for folks to head out to try Livin Large! I actually predict that Dave is going to go ‘all kinds of obsessed’ when he trecks out with Nalle to scope it out, and I hope his infectious enthusiasm gets the crew cranking on this incredible piece of rock. The fairytale is a few repeats of this thing on video!!! Wish I wasn’t just a fanboy reading about this shit, but that’s how it is!
loading...
Peeling of the top off Living Large looks like a sure fire way to bust an ankle or worse…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_kx5srNLH5U
loading...
Props to Nalle for throwing down the gauntlet.
When I first read about it i thought yea what an ego on that guy.
But that guy is a professional athlete aspiring to prove himself as the best in the sport (which he very well might be).
I can see why he feels slighted by Paul; Paul says his project wasn’t that inspiring, then puts up a bunch of lines around the area and calls them the same grade.
Nalle comes back and crushes one of them in half an hour and says ‘no really if you wanna call something as hard as LL come do LL first’. And lets be real, that line is as proud as any I’ve ever seen. Tall, clean and hard as hell (if Ondra put time into it and it didnt go? pshh that shits hard).
Way back in the day Bachar challenged anyone in the Valley to follow him for a day soloing (with a $1000 reward if they did). Thats the stuff of legends; kudos to Nalle for doing similar.
loading...
A couple problems with this:
1) Paul has WAY more experience with the V15 grade than Nalle. If anything, we should be saying that if Nalle wants to talk about what V15 is, he should do Terremer, TSOTW, Paint it Black, Monkey Wedding, or any of the CONFIRMED V15s that Paul has done. Nalle has never actually done a confirmed V15 (Livin’ Large seems like it could be, but until it’s repeated we can only speculate).
2) The discrepancy in grades is the result of new beta being found after the FA. It’s really not an issue of overgrading. There’s no reason Nalle should offended by Paul calling something the same grade as LL, in this case.
loading...
Paul says: ‘that would mean i would have to spend 30(4)(8)=960 rand to send livin large… that is approximately 130 US dollars if not more to send a mere boulder problem. I just DONT have those funds when i could climb even more amazing projects for free.”
-If BD can’t spot you the $130 to step up and try and send LL, I’m sure Nalle will
loading...
Colin, you are right, US $130 should not be an issue to a professional climber — or pretty much to anybody. As a comparison, Dai Koyamada flew all the way from Japan to Europe just to send a single climb, The Story, for the _second_ time. Now that is commitment!
loading...
Dai owns his own gym and probably makes a lot more than Paul does being a professional climber. Sure he is sponsored by big companies, but hes not Alex Honnold or Chris Sharma.
loading...
This is ridiculous, Nalle is a complete hypocrite and definitely not bold or humble. 1) he didn’t exactly send lucid dreaming, and by didn’t exactly I obviously mean DIDNT 2) be respectful enough of other pro climbers before you lambast them via the internet to mention you found new better beta (others have found easier beta to sharma boulders and didn’t get such harsh criticism) 3) Nalle hasn’t climbed The Story of Two Worlds while Paul nabbed the 2 or 3rd ascent depending on how you view Dai’s first ascent of the problem- thus maybe Nalle doesn’t even actually have the ability to grade V15 as he insinuates to Paul with the “what I consider V15” comment – and obviously Dave proclaimed it the new benchmark back in c.2005. I think Nalle’s super strong, maybe the best boulderer in the world but he needs an ego check for sure. He shouldn’t have given sharma a hard time about FRFM since he hasn’t climbed a 15a never mind a 15b/c, why call someone out on the internet over a route you obviously weren’t going to send? Now this, and putting a pic of LL up as a call out? How about he goes and sends TSTW’s before being so bold next time and maybe give LD another try before publicly lambasting another climber.
loading...
Wait, so I’m confused. Does this mean that professional climbers are NOT moral paragons? Looks like I need to rethink my life…
loading...
i noticed yesterday that Nalle also downgraded two of Paul’s v13s to v11. Since yesterday Paul has removed one of them on 27crags (The Steady Plums) and made an “Edit on grade” statement on the other (In Search of The New Sound)…
loading...
Paul changed it to The Steady Plums (Direct) to distinguish between what he originally did and the easier version that subsequent climbers have done.
Apparently, In Search of the New Sound was also a bit of a contrivance the way Paul did it, and the new grade reflects the difficulty of the uncontrived version of the climb.
Nalle is the only climber who repeated these lines who failed to mention that he climbed something somewhat different than what the first ascentionist did. At best, this seems pretty tactless.
loading...
didn’t see the The Steady Plums Direct (makes sense) and agreed.
loading...
Do we know that nalle did know about the exact/ bad beta that paul used?
Anyone seen the irony of climbing something with bad beta and calling it ” A simple knowing”?
😀
loading...
What’s the bet every FA at topside gets sandbagged as heel from now on…
loading...
Climbing needs this kind of stuff. All these excuses why these grades are so fluffy “oh there’s new beta” or “well didn’t go the way the FA went, he went the uncontrived way” is just weak. The grade is the grade. All you fluffers who think he should have been nicer about his opinion of the real grade should see that real grades are GOOD. If these fellows are really such professionals (professional climber being one of the great oxymorons of our generation, emphasis on moron) then just maybe their massive egos can handle a real opinion of difficulty?
Giant egos, giant numbers, tiny rocks. You guys slay me!
loading...
It’s not about grades or egos or professionals. It’s about not being a dick.
loading...
These guys are all extremely competitive (I know all of them personally), and I don’t think they always handle it in the best way. Just because they are the strongest climbers in the world doesn’t mean they aren’t above being jealous, insecure and mean-spirited, despite what their blogs/8a comments/BigUp movies would have you think (none of them are immune to this). Their strong fingers also don’t equate to being good politicians, which in todays climate of publicity is very important for the “professional” climber. I generally like all of the people involved in this “debate”, however, they are not superheroes, and to think otherwise is extremely naive. I’d like to hope that everyone acts with the utmost intentions, but that is very rarely the case, in climbing or in life. In particular, many of the top climbers are generally very selfish, competitive, and passionate people. That is why they are such good climbers, and perhaps so poor with public relations. It also makes them very interesting people, but this kind of bickering, while never justified, should almost be expected. The only real response it seems is to either sit back and laugh at the entertainment (did Carlo really call someone an ego-a-hole for not disclosing their beta?), or just ignore it and be thankful there are so many new boulders to go try. I’m psyched Paul’s put effort into developing a new area that looks worthwhile. Someday I’d like to climb his boulders at Topside. I’m psyched Nalle made the effort (and spent the $180 or so) and climbed the FA of Livin’ Large. It stands as one of the best and hardest problems in the world, regardless of what is said online. The bickering will die by the wayside as the new hungry crowd internet demands more. What is left in the wake are some of the best boulder problems in the world.
loading...
*news hungry internet crowd
loading...
At the same time why can’t they attempt to conduct themselves in a more mature manner. Climbing is their livelihood, it’s their job, and to conduct yourself in that manner with a regular 9 to 5 job would carry with it penalties and/or a “talking to” of sorts. I have the utmost respect for all these climbers and in no way will I say I know any of them personally, but their attitude and actions must still be held to a certain standard.
loading...
Poor comparison. Try real money pro sports, or maybe hollywood with less beautiful people and you’ll see the behavior isn’t far off.
loading...